I ask you again: Are you sure that the application time has already expired?? If the job is still listed, then probably not.
And you don't seem to get the point: you are competing with people who have WORK experience.
I guess you haven't read the replies carefully, because you say:
"I assume that the people applying for do not have any industry experience". It's simply not true. Read back.
Why is it so hard to look at things from the employers' point of view? I could do that.
So, I'm the employer, I advertise a junior position. I receive 300 applications. 150 of them came from an experienced applicant (WORK experience). Why should I choose an unexperienced candidate? Just because I stated in the ad that it's a junior position? It's not obligatory for the employer to employ an unexperienced person just because it's told in the ad, that "experience isn't required".
"I mean, what do they do if they sell some hudred thousends or even millions of ..."
Millions?? In your dreams. 1 million Elvis Presley records are sold.
Overall: you seem to act a immature prick now:
"And what really disappoints me here is that you all say that people from college or with sufficient personal(massive spare time consumed) work means nothing. But this is also what I expected initially. I am totally useless and worthless. Great, you got me."
Who the hell told you that?? Everyone here said that you should build a great portfolio. You seem to totally stuck with the "no one replies". 8 companies, and the application times may not even be expired.
"I feel that nobody in the game industry works there because of passion, but for moneny what is NOT my concern."
How the hell did you make this conclusion anyway???
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No Answer about Application - Am I totally useless?
Author
Quote:
I ask you again: Are you sure that the application time has already expired?? If the job is still listed, then probably not.
I dont know. Where should I know this from?
Quote:
I guess you haven't read the replies carefully, because you say:
"I assume that the people applying for do not have any industry experience". It's simply not true. Read back.
You know, I make all my expectations of what I read or hear. Please read the whole sentence where you see that I stated exaclty that I cite the vacany proposal! And not something out of my dreams.
Millions?? In your dreams. 1 million Elvis Presley records are sold.
[/qutoe]
Then head to gametrailers.com and listen to those guys, I think some of those might have a clue of whats going on. Ok, it may depend on the company. But wait, you cite companies that have 15000 application. So I assume that this company is big so their turnover might be big. I guess, a company with -30 peoply where I applied does not have that hundreds of applications you claim they have in the two week period.Quote:
Overall: you seem to act a immature prick now:
"And what really disappoints me here is that you all say that people from college or with sufficient personal(massive spare time consumed) work means nothing. But this is also what I expected initially. I am totally useless and worthless. Great, you got me."
Come on. Please read the post where I started this thread. I told you of some of my skills, which I considered as beeing enough to know for you to discuss a little, why I dont get any reply to a junior position application. And so I deduced that the stuff what I made is not enough. It was even proposed to do an unpaid internship. This is what I extracted from all the previous post. And I want to say again, please dont compare me with you. I can not afford to do 130 applications, because I dont do templated stuff. I need approx. two days for a single application with company specific variation.
Caution:
I am aware of the employer side. I see that those guys do have to look for good employees because such a person costs money and such tasks are time intensive. I have said this several times in my post before. So please stop blaming me for what you wrongly assume!
Author
I would say, my questions are answered.
The fundamental point is:
1.) I need industry experience.
2.) My personal work does not count.
3.) Work on my portfolio, but do not extend it with personal work, because it is minor considered to no. 1.), because of 2.)
Thank you for all your time and patience.
The fundamental point is:
1.) I need industry experience.
2.) My personal work does not count.
3.) Work on my portfolio, but do not extend it with personal work, because it is minor considered to no. 1.), because of 2.)
Thank you for all your time and patience.
About the number of employees thing:
Smaller doesn't mean that they will hire someone easier. At all. It's more likely the opposite: small companies can't afford the risk of unexperienced employees, while bigger companies can. Lot of them even have internships, trainer programs.
The particular company I applied was John Deere, so we can say it's big. But that doesn't mean that smaller companies don't receive lots of applications. The least applications I know of was 43 or something. And it was a small company in a shitty place.
I spent many time with my 130 applications. Not from the beginning but the last 120 was carefully aimed/written. I completely rewrote my CV about 5-6 times, my cover letter template (there was a skeleton, after 20 letters you can't rephrase every letters). Some letters took only 3 hours, some took 2 days, I didn't just shoot at everything I saw. Maybe that was a problem, maybe I should have sent 200 applications, and spend the time for going out and meeting people instead of struggling with well aimed letters/CV:s.
Smaller doesn't mean that they will hire someone easier. At all. It's more likely the opposite: small companies can't afford the risk of unexperienced employees, while bigger companies can. Lot of them even have internships, trainer programs.
The particular company I applied was John Deere, so we can say it's big. But that doesn't mean that smaller companies don't receive lots of applications. The least applications I know of was 43 or something. And it was a small company in a shitty place.
I spent many time with my 130 applications. Not from the beginning but the last 120 was carefully aimed/written. I completely rewrote my CV about 5-6 times, my cover letter template (there was a skeleton, after 20 letters you can't rephrase every letters). Some letters took only 3 hours, some took 2 days, I didn't just shoot at everything I saw. Maybe that was a problem, maybe I should have sent 200 applications, and spend the time for going out and meeting people instead of struggling with well aimed letters/CV:s.
Quote: Original post by notnoted
I would say, my questions are answered.
The fundamental point is:
1.) I need industry experience.
2.) My personal work does not count.
3.) Work on my portfolio, but do not extend it with personal work, because it is minor considered to no. 1.), because of 2.)
Thank you for all your time and patience.
I can say one thing to that: You'll grow up, and you will see other colors, not just black and white.
Author
You know, I put down very subtle stuff during my post here, but all you see are some tiny part that are rather unimportant.
To be honest, I appreciate your comment and your experience, but you just come up with stuff like, "I need industry experience", "Employers dont have time becuase they have hundreds to thousands of applications".
@sidenote
you sais they cant even answer my application by writing two lines via an email but I should call there to disturb them for several minuts? This is a contradiction.
@sidenote end
I really dont have to grow up, however you mean this, you just want to affront me for what ever or because I have affronted you in some case where I want to apologise for. I initially posted very distinct skills of mine and not black and white stuff. Then tell me your interpretation of "Very often +3 year experienced developers are hired for a junior position". What is your interpretation of that. I think you will come up with the same idea as I did!
As I said several times, I dont write things that emerged out of my deams but from reality. I cited one vacancy proposal, in order to show you that I am skilled enough for it. But you all came up with experience and mass application flood in the HR of those companies. This is the essence of all posts here in this thread. And no one here even noted my skill or gave an proposal what to do instead, except unpaid internships. And I finally got it.
The game industry is the wrong place to start a career. I also read all websites that were linked in this thread, which put a similar picture of my situation.
I want to apologise if I misunderstood something and if I put some comment with some kind of sarcasm.
To be honest, I appreciate your comment and your experience, but you just come up with stuff like, "I need industry experience", "Employers dont have time becuase they have hundreds to thousands of applications".
@sidenote
you sais they cant even answer my application by writing two lines via an email but I should call there to disturb them for several minuts? This is a contradiction.
@sidenote end
I really dont have to grow up, however you mean this, you just want to affront me for what ever or because I have affronted you in some case where I want to apologise for. I initially posted very distinct skills of mine and not black and white stuff. Then tell me your interpretation of "Very often +3 year experienced developers are hired for a junior position". What is your interpretation of that. I think you will come up with the same idea as I did!
As I said several times, I dont write things that emerged out of my deams but from reality. I cited one vacancy proposal, in order to show you that I am skilled enough for it. But you all came up with experience and mass application flood in the HR of those companies. This is the essence of all posts here in this thread. And no one here even noted my skill or gave an proposal what to do instead, except unpaid internships. And I finally got it.
The game industry is the wrong place to start a career. I also read all websites that were linked in this thread, which put a similar picture of my situation.
I want to apologise if I misunderstood something and if I put some comment with some kind of sarcasm.
I came up with:
*are you sure the application has expired? If not: call them
*be more persistent: 8-10 applications are not much
*post your application+CV+portfolio here, so you we can comment on it
*build a portfolio, I don't know where did you get the idea that it's worthless, it is a good way to stand out
*whining doesn't help at all
*are you sure the application has expired? If not: call them
*be more persistent: 8-10 applications are not much
*post your application+CV+portfolio here, so you we can comment on it
*build a portfolio, I don't know where did you get the idea that it's worthless, it is a good way to stand out
*whining doesn't help at all
Quote: you sais they cant even answer my application by writing two lines via an email but I should call there to disturb them for several minuts? This is a contradiction.
Yes. Anyone can ignore an email and not give a second thought to it. A phone call is extremely difficult to ignore and they have to commit to it. It isn't a case of manners or how busy they are but getting attention. (Companies SHOULD reply back to every application in the ideal world but they don't).
Personally, if the company can't be arsed to send a simple email back, I don't see why I should consider them when I a make a phone call that *might* disturb them.
Quote: I really dont have to grow up, however you mean this, you just want to affront me for what ever or because I have affronted you in some case where I want to apologise for. I initially posted very distinct skills of mine and not black and white stuff. Then tell me your interpretation of "Very often +3 year experienced developers are hired for a junior position". What is your interpretation of that. I think you will come up with the same idea as I did!
No. What he said is that different companies and different people in those companies with rate/consider things differently. What one person/company is looking for primarily may be different to another person/company.
There is no black and white answer for what exactly ALL companies are looking for.
Quote: And no one here even noted my skill or gave an proposal what to do instead, except unpaid internships. And I finally got it.
We all noted your skill. Without seeing your Resume and Portfolio (which I asked for), you are only left with several answers:
- Keep trying and keep working on games/portfolio
- Get industry experience (paid or unpaid)
- Get experience in another industry
Quote: The game industry is the wrong place to start a career.
It certainly isn't. (As I and many others have started in this industry). It is just extremely difficult in these times as we said many times but it can still be done.
I think part of the problem is that you are expecting there to be some set path to get a job at a games company when their isn't. There are multiple routes and methods to get a job. For example, a Level Designer at Media Molecule got his job by making levels for Little Big Planet. He got invited for an interview by the company as they saw his levels and he got the job.
He was builder. With no degree.
He was builder. With no degree.
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