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I'm having trouble attracting contributors to my project as it gets older

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23 comments, last by Orymus3 9 years, 1 month ago

I've been working on an open source RPG for a number of years [link]. In the first 3-4 years, finding help was never a problem for us. However, as our project has gotten older it has been more and more difficult to find people to help out. I made a post on our website recently explaining that this project has essentially become a 'one-man army' now because despite my efforts, I've failed utterly at recruiting others to join the project. I've tried recruiting from multiple different sites (including here, where the majority of our contributors have come from historically). I've tried making the on-boarding process as simple as possible. I've documented and organized all the information that someone new would need to know to get started. I've been sharing screenshots and videos of the latest progress I've been making.

I'm really running out of ideas here on what I can do to attract help. My next attempt is to publish a new development release, but it takes a long time when I have to do the work all by myself.

What would you suggest I do to attract contributors to this project again?

Keep in mind I'm working solo right now and don't have a lot of time to spare. So suggestions like "completely overhaul your website" just aren't going to happen. Some people have suggested that because we're not using the new popular services like GitHub, we're not going to attract help. While I'm not against migrating to a new hosting service or revisioning system, it seems odd to me that that would be the lone reason why I can't get any help. Plus I don't really consider doing things like this a priority right now when I'm working alone. I'd rather invest what little time I have in making progress on the title, not the services we use surrounding it.

Are people generally ageist against joining older projects?

I can totally understand why an older project might not be as attractive as a new one. Much of the vision in gameplay, artwork, and music has been more or less defined now. It's harder to put forth your ideas and have them considered if it requires a major redesign to implement them. And there's perhaps not as much excitement as there is for a newly birthed project. I just hope people realize that an established project has its own set of benefits. I find it ironic how so many people were willing to jump on my train when we were starting out. I was so ignorant and naive in those early days, but perhaps we all were then.

Hero of Allacrost - A free, open-source 2D RPG in development.
Latest release June, 2015 - GameDev annoucement

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Hi Roots,

I'll speak from experience, knowing I was 'sort of on the team' SEVERAL years back.

First, there's the obvious problem: the project has aged. The JRPG was much more en vogue back then, and rpg makers needed competition. Allacrost was one of the titles that stood out with an interesting twist on the ATB system.

Nowadays however, JRPG is not at its peak (though it is definitely present in one form or another, it has generally translated to lush 3d which may not have been as appealing 5-6 years ago).

The combat system of Allacrost is no longer 'exciting news', and the story may not appear as compelling. Despite my profound respect to your ability to stick to the project for so long, I think Allacrost may be a dated concept now.

More importantly however, I distincly remember how you were running the project back then, and I would be tempted to believe that a lot of talented people ultimately turned away from the project based on your attitude.

Rather than focusing on getting new recruits, I think you should've focused on keeping the most efficient team members onboard with sufficient incentive and respect. I don't know the whole story (4 years is a long time) but from the particular era where I was interested in the project, I feel you've done a poor job at keeping the team onboard and that may be the hidden truth to look at here.

Also, I would imagine that 4 years into this project, the core of the actual design phase should be done. You *should* be focused on finishing a project. The problem is that most of the people that are interested in spending their time on a project expect some form of say on the design/feel of the game. If all there's left to do is content and debug, you may be fighting an uphill battle.

That being said, let's focus on how you can attract people:

I suppose money is out of the question?

What other form of compensation can you currently offer to potential team members?

What 'can't' you do yourself? Art? Programming? Music?

What CAN you do yourself? How long would it take to complete (I realize that's probably a wild guess, but let's shoot a number here and see what that means for the project)?

Your project being old is implicitly a sign that it isn’t going to get done. Even major companies can’t escape scrutiny if a project lasts more than several years (Duke Nukem Forever), let alone a single-person indie/hobby project.
All it shows is that you can’t finish what you start.

So the best way to get people to help is to finish the project. If that sounds chicken-and-egg, throwing in the key words, “cut your losses” might help it make more sense.

Cut features you don’t need and consider releasing a prototype that may be missing obvious features such as music for a scene.
At least once you have a playable product that appears to be 99% complete people will start filling in the gaps for you again.

And at this point, finishing it and releasing it really is your absolute top priority, not for the sake of this 1 insignificant project, but for your reputation. If you don’t release something, even if it is not finished, how do you expect to garner support for the next project? You really really really need to establish a track record of being able to complete what you start, so despite the effort you have put into this project it’s time to either scrap it or finish it.


L. Spiro

I restore Nintendo 64 video-game OST’s into HD! https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCCtX_wedtZ5BoyQBXEhnVZw/playlists?view=1&sort=lad&flow=grid

I'll gladly admit that my management of this project could have been better. I've learned a lot along the way, and I'd like to think I've gotten better. More than anything, this project fell apart whenever I was not very active on it. I have other hobbies and a life outside of this, and it's just supposed to be a fun thing to work with others to create. Another major reason the project was so heavily delayed was that we did everything from scratch (game engine, etc). We were really just a bunch of young adults fresh out of college without a clue about how to make a game, and much of the first few years was really a learning process for all of us. (To be fair: I always, always warn people to use an existing game engine now when I hear of someone considering rolling their own). Anyway, yes I/we made a lot of mistakes in the past. We learned from them. I don't disagree that we should focus on retaining people rather than finding new ones, but I can't do that until the size of the team is more than just myself.


I suppose money is out of the question?

What other form of compensation can you currently offer to potential team members?

What 'can't' you do yourself? Art? Programming? Music?

What CAN you do yourself? How long would it take to complete (I realize that's probably a wild guess, but let's shoot a number here and see what that means for the project)?

1) Yes. I can't afford to pay for a whole team myself when this is a free project. Plus I feel it would be a slap in the face to start paying people for the same work that you and I and others in the past have done.

2) People should work on this project if they think it sounds like fun and will help improve their skills. And of course enjoy doing so in the process. That's all I can really offer anyone. I try to make sure I'm still enjoying it too, so it's not "just work". I don't know what else I can say. I'm pretty clear about what we offer to people when I post a help wanted ad.

3) I can do almost everything myself, and have been. I've also been pulling in freely usable assests where I can (opengameart.org is a lifesaver). Everything that needs to be done right now can be done by myself. There's just too much for one person who has a full-time job, girlfriend, triathlete, etc. outside of the project.

4) I'm doing everything I can right now to get out a partial release so people can play and see that we really have something. How long it takes depends on the other demands in my life. I don't have an abundance of free time. If I get lucky, end of the month isn't out of the picture. But we're looking at more like end of June if I continue to go solo (which I obviously don't want to do).


Your project being old is implicitly a sign that it isn’t going to get done. Even major companies can’t escape scrutiny if a project lasts more than several years (Duke Nukem Forever), let alone a single-person indie/hobby project.
All it shows is that you can’t finish what you start.

We have made several playable releases in the past (that were sort of like mini-RPGs with a couple hours of content). We've proven that we have and can produce something. Far, far more projects die before they see a single release, so I'd argue that we're still better off than most. The project has laid dormant for a good number of years, so it's not like its been under continuous development either.

I have done what you suggested to "cut the fat" and just get something out there. But now that I think about it, perhaps we need to cut a little more. I was getting stuck with some early game scripting that really isn't necessary. After reading what you said and thinking about it, I'm just going to cut that portion out for now. It can easily be added in later. I'll work on the more important parts instead. Thanks.

Hero of Allacrost - A free, open-source 2D RPG in development.
Latest release June, 2015 - GameDev annoucement


this project fell apart whenever I was not very active on it.

+


3) I can do almost everything myself, and have been. I've also been pulling in freely usable assests where I can (opengameart.org is a lifesaver). Everything that needs to be done right now can be done by myself. There's just too much for one person who has a full-time job, girlfriend, triathlete, etc. outside of the project.

This displays a lot of ambition, ambition which will often drive people away.

If you want to create a game by a team you need to be really fast at finishing it, until time will disintegrate the team. Once you have a project with lot of progress, it will be really hard to join the project and to satisfy the demands of the core developer(s).

Instead of creating a game which needs a team to get finished, you should create a game which can be easily finished by a sole-developer. If someone else joins, be happy, if not, just continue. So, if you want to save your project, cut a lot of features down until a single dev can easily handle it (the rest will get difficult on its own). If you think that this is not possible due to dispatching the whole game concept, pull the plug.

2) People should work on this project if they think it sounds like fun and will help improve their skills. And of course enjoy doing so in the process. That's all I can really offer anyone. I try to make sure I'm still enjoying it too, so it's not "just work". I don't know what else I can say. I'm pretty clear about what we offer to people when I post a help wanted ad.

From the point of view of an artist, they want their work to be enjoyed by a lot of players. They want recognition.

How much buzz and hype has there been from the gaming side? Are there any players interested in playing this game? If there aren't, then it'll certainly be difficult to find artists willing to invest their time in a project that does not have that "commercial greed," that goal of having as many players as possible (even if it's a free project).
Serious artists are able to practice by themselves, and they get to make their own decisions this way. Perhaps it's needed some other incentive than just being able to practice skills.

I am afraid I don't have anything useful to offer other than my best wishes. I hope you are able to find a way to progress with your project at a good pace.

I'll gladly admit that my management of this project could have been better. I've learned a lot along the way, and I'd like to think I've gotten better. More than anything, this project fell apart whenever I was not very active on it. I have other hobbies and a life outside of this, and it's just supposed to be a fun thing to work with others to create. Another major reason the project was so heavily delayed was that we did everything from scratch (game engine, etc). We were really just a bunch of young adults fresh out of college without a clue about how to make a game, and much of the first few years was really a learning process for all of us.


From my perspective it kinda sounds like what you want is not contributors, but friends to work on the project with you in your collective off-time. If this is the case, then Ashaman's "race against time" comment applies more than ever, because there is nothing concrete (things like remuneration, recognition by a large player following, potential for future employment in the games industry, etc..) holding them on the project. Probably "I have a life outside of this" is the very reason your existing team members eventually dropped out, at some point they decided there just wasn't enough in it for them compared to the effort they have and continue to put in, and that was that; I suspect the majority of your team members were in their early 20's when they joined the project, life situations tend to change quite quickly at that age and people may find themselves with no more time or energy to work on a project they previously had lots of time to dedicate to.

As for the problem of finding new contributors, besides the fact that in general, from a purely opportunistic point of view, greenfield projects are more attractive to join than 10-year-old projects (where one would probably end up assigned to endless bugfixing and polishing tasks), consider also that a project that apparently used to have a team years ago but eventually lost all its members but the lead developer just screams "abandoned" to an outside observer. If you really are intent on continuing this project, you need to dispel those impressions, and that does mean marketing your project to get players (and contributors!) interested in it. I took a look at your project's forum and it's the very definition of dead.

“If I understand the standard right it is legal and safe to do this but the resulting value could be anything.”

With a project this old, it will help if you can say the project will be done in X(6?) months while recruiting. (aka i need a graphics-artist(?) to help me out for 6 months, then the game will be released.)


There's just too much for one person who has a full-time job, girlfriend, triathlete, etc. outside of the project.

That's actually fairly little.

Personally, I run a fulltime job (video game industry management), a part-time job (video game industry freelancer), have a wife, 2 kids, and I find some time to take part in game jams here and there (not mentionning the work I put in as DM or towards competitive board games, of course).

The most proficient indie I know has 3 kids and is stay-at-home but still manages to deliver quality game after quality game in crazy short cycles. And he goes to all of the tradeshows!

By today's standards, your "life" is anything but busy to be honest. And I'm not even starting on Silicon Valley folks... Are you sure this isn't just an excuse to "have a life" and "watch the occasional TV show"? There's nothing wrong with either, but it is a conscious decision that further pushes your release date for sure.


If I get lucky, end of the month isn't out of the picture. But we're looking at more like end of June if I continue to go solo (

Which is fairly short, especially given the time invested in the project so far! How partial of a release would that be?

Reading you so far, I'd feel like going solo is far from being the worst thing you could do.

Adjust scope, work on it, and ship it?

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